Comments on: Returning to Eden: Futuristic Symbolism and its Effects on Jehovah's Witnesses http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/ Just another WordPress weblog Thu, 09 Feb 2012 01:24:03 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.1 hourly 1 By: Jose Castro http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-27241 Jose Castro Fri, 25 Mar 2011 17:50:49 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-27241 It's funny how people think it is a threat for a JW to read an article like this. BTW, very informative from a sociological perspective. Now, there are somethings that we have to put in their fair perspective. For example, the last paragraph mentions of how we, JW's, are willing to use resources from this world that we found so repugnant, well, it's interesting that this article doesn't, at any point, touches on WHY we do what we do, and merely the author tries to explain it by simple analysis (please, excuse my English, it is not my first language)or looking at our organization as another social organisation where people get together and try to do something by their own will. The Bible itself mentions how when the Israelites where driven away from Egypt by Jehovah, many Egypians gave them gold and other resources, also, in the first century, great christians such as the apostle Paul made use of the Law to defend himself, and the cause of his ministry. In matters, of business, didn't Jesus said: pay to Ceasar what is due to him?. So, we definitely are not physically out of this world, but we try, LIKE JESUS SAID when he prayed to his Father-not that YOU remove them from the world, but that YOU may take care of them-we try to have a good relationship with God in order to receive his care: SPIRITUALY, which is more important to us than: physical care. Now, this article suggest that social happiness or economical success is not possible in the CURRENT system of things out of Jehovah's people, well, that is not, by any means, true, actually the happiest people in the world (physically speaking) are those who love and trust this world, this is their place, they comform with this ephemeral life, while we JW's look forward to everlasting life and in the meanwhile, try our best to be GREAT citizens, like everywhere, there are rotten tomatoes, but our point is to learn and teach what the BIble says, and is not to control people's lives, everyone should decide how to react to these teachings. We are only looking to be good Christians, and definitely this is the BEST place you'll ever find. I'm not saying you'll be the best person in the world, but you'll now the truth about God, and will be able to engage in a rational form of worship. The thing that most amazes me is who people show their disgust at us while we try to be better persons by learning high moral standards and promoting love to one another, and at the same time they are sad with those who teach hate toward one another, or teach empty beleifs, like that you're going to burn in a fire Hell, or that you have to punish yourself when you sin, or that you have to belong to a superior caste in your religion, you know- and the world is full of these overwhelming sensless practices like cutting youreslf in order to please God, and that God has many heads, etc.- (BTW, I have many friends from different religions and never judge them by that-I'm a witness not a judge, ande Jesus set the example of sharing with people who do not share your beleifs) we are trying to have a clean form of worship, to follow a more decent system of religiousity avoiding unnecessary practices, but only following what our leader Jesus commanded us to do, and following the example of his first followers. We talk about paradise, YES, and we love it!!! is the only thing that makes sense for the future of mankind, and appeals to the worst conditions of this world, YES, because the vast majority of this world is in the worst conditions, but some live in their close minded- EUROPEAN-ENGLISH AMERICA world where every act of violence and drug dealing is covered under a pink coat. The reality as the Bible states is that many people are starving from hearing good news, and not just a promise of a new house or a new car-yes, sincere people. Still, we approach everyone and try to respect everyone. Avoiding comments like some of the above where you call people whom you don't know anything about what ever you want to call them, that's just rude. BTW, thos ewho become fanataics and later go away from the Org. is because they don't know how to have a balance, we are not require to be saints (in the total sense of the world), but to try our best, and promote harmony in the world. It’s funny how people think it is a threat for a JW to read an article like this. BTW, very informative from a sociological perspective. Now, there are somethings that we have to put in their fair perspective. For example, the last paragraph mentions of how we, JW’s, are willing to use resources from this world that we found so repugnant, well, it’s interesting that this article doesn’t, at any point, touches on WHY we do what we do, and merely the author tries to explain it by simple analysis (please, excuse my English, it is not my first language)or looking at our organization as another social organisation where people get together and try to do something by their own will. The Bible itself mentions how when the Israelites where driven away from Egypt by Jehovah, many Egypians gave them gold and other resources, also, in the first century, great christians such as the apostle Paul made use of the Law to defend himself, and the cause of his ministry. In matters, of business, didn’t Jesus said: pay to Ceasar what is due to him?. So, we definitely are not physically out of this world, but we try, LIKE JESUS SAID when he prayed to his Father-not that YOU remove them from the world, but that YOU may take care of them-we try to have a good relationship with God in order to receive his care: SPIRITUALY, which is more important to us than: physical care. Now, this article suggest that social happiness or economical success is not possible in the CURRENT system of things out of Jehovah’s people, well, that is not, by any means, true, actually the happiest people in the world
(physically speaking) are those who love and trust this world, this is their place, they comform with this ephemeral life, while we JW’s look forward to everlasting life and in the meanwhile, try our best to be GREAT citizens, like everywhere, there are rotten tomatoes, but our point is to learn and teach what the BIble says, and is not to control people’s lives, everyone should decide how to react to these teachings. We are only looking to be good Christians, and definitely this is the BEST place you’ll ever find. I’m not saying you’ll be the best person in the world, but you’ll now the truth about God, and will be able to engage in a rational form of worship. The thing that most amazes me is who people show their disgust at us while we try to be better persons by learning high moral standards and promoting love to one another, and at the same time they are sad with those who teach hate toward one another, or teach empty beleifs, like that you’re going to burn in a fire Hell, or that you have to punish yourself when you sin, or that you have to belong to a superior caste in your religion, you know- and the world is full of these overwhelming sensless practices like cutting youreslf in order to please God, and that God has many heads, etc.- (BTW, I have many friends from different religions and never judge them by that-I’m a witness not a judge, ande Jesus set the example of sharing with people who do not share your beleifs) we are trying to have a clean form of worship, to follow a more decent system of religiousity avoiding unnecessary practices, but only following what our leader Jesus commanded us to do, and following the example of his first followers. We talk about paradise, YES, and we love it!!! is the only thing that makes sense for the future of mankind, and appeals to the worst conditions of this world, YES, because the vast majority of this world is in the worst conditions, but some live in their close minded- EUROPEAN-ENGLISH AMERICA world where every act of violence and drug dealing is covered under a pink coat. The reality as the Bible states is that many people are starving from hearing good news, and not just a promise of a new house or a new car-yes, sincere people. Still, we approach everyone and try to respect everyone. Avoiding comments like some of the above where you call people whom you don’t know anything about what ever you want to call them, that’s just rude. BTW, thos ewho become fanataics and later go away from the Org. is because they don’t know how to have a balance, we are not require to be saints (in the total sense of the world), but to try our best, and promote harmony in the world.

]]> By: Rosina http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-2741 Rosina Mon, 06 Aug 2007 23:50:22 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-2741 Good work! This is such a hugely insightful article for someone who has not been a JW themselves. You actually 'took me back' to what it was like. And shed a little light on how the religion is strangely special. I was raised a JW from birth, rebelled as a teen and made an attempt to rejoin in my early twenties, before finally doing some research on the internet and reading Crisis of Conscience which enabled me to break free. (I'm now 30) As did my older sister. My mum is still devout and probably always will be, and we have contact with her, but will always see everything through her 'joho glasses'. Thankyou for your article. Good work!

This is such a hugely insightful article for someone who has not been a JW themselves. You actually ‘took me back’ to what it was like. And shed a little light on how the religion is strangely special. I was raised a JW from birth, rebelled as a teen and made an attempt to rejoin in my early twenties, before finally doing some research on the internet and reading Crisis of Conscience which enabled me to break free. (I’m now 30) As did my older sister.

My mum is still devout and probably always will be, and we have contact with her, but will always see everything through her ‘joho glasses’.

Thankyou for your article.

]]> By: otto marconi http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-2740 otto marconi Sun, 10 Jun 2007 10:46:16 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-2740 to 'Not to be published' below: Hi amigos, please keep believing in what you stated, please stay with the joiaeuvaieh witlesses. Hey! Faithful and Disgraceful Slavebugger (the governing-bloody-body of the witlesses), I wish to thank you for attracting within your enclosures so many morons, thanks really, cos there are too many already in the real world, so we can share the burden. Bye to ‘Not to be published’ below:

Hi amigos, please keep believing in what you stated, please stay with the joiaeuvaieh witlesses.

Hey! Faithful and Disgraceful Slavebugger (the governing-bloody-body of the witlesses), I wish to thank you for attracting within your enclosures so many morons, thanks really, cos there are too many already in the real world, so we can share the burden.

Bye

]]> By: tsegaye http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-2739 tsegaye Wed, 17 Jan 2007 08:58:51 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-2739 tank you i have read aweak . it very god.i have think money new thing.it agood news in aweak megazine.tanks your kingodam tank you i have read aweak . it very god.i have think money new thing.it agood news in aweak megazine.tanks your kingodam

]]> By: John http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-2738 John Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:57:52 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-2738 Interesting statistics. The one thing I would like to point out though is the statement, "Perhaps the most extensive persecution of the Witnesses in the 20th century was that of the Nazi regime in Germany a generation ago..." This is somewhat of a misleading statement promulgated by the WTBTS themselves. At that time in Nazi Germany there were no "Jehovah's Witnesses" per se; there only "Bible Students." Not all of the Bible Students were associated at all with the WTBTS at that time, or ever did become associated with it. The Nazi's lumped them all together, and the WT does so also, to bolster it's numbers. I am a Bible Student, not associated with the WT at all. Our beliefs are quite different. Interesting statistics.

The one thing I would like to point out though is the statement, “Perhaps the most extensive persecution of the Witnesses in the 20th century was that of the Nazi regime in Germany a generation ago…”

This is somewhat of a misleading statement promulgated by the WTBTS themselves. At that time in Nazi Germany there were no “Jehovah’s Witnesses” per se; there only “Bible Students.”

Not all of the Bible Students were associated at all with the WTBTS at that time, or ever did become associated with it. The Nazi’s lumped them all together, and the WT does so also, to bolster it’s numbers.

I am a Bible Student, not associated with the WT at all. Our beliefs are quite different.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-2737 Anonymous Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:48:24 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-2737 feature often pointed to in the Watchtower publications is that Jehovah's Witnesses have been persecuted and sometimes even been killed in some countries. This is true, of course. Perhaps the most extensive persecution of the Witnesses in the 20th century was that of the Nazi regime in Germany a generation ago, when 2,000 Witnesses were sent to concentration camps, 203 of which were executed and over 600 others died in prison due to diseases, undernourishment, and other causes. (The 1974 Yearbook of Jehovah's Witnesses, page 212.) But Jehovah's Witnesses are not the only group that has been persecuted in this century. Totalitarian countries have often persecuted various groups of Christians. In the former Sovjet Union most and sometimes all Christian groups were forbidden and persecuted, and periodically thousands of Christians were killed in campaigns aimed at rooting out religion. On January 27, 1996, Vladimir Naumov, chief of the Russian commission for the restoration of victims of political oppression, revealed that half a million priests had been persecuted by the Sovjet State, over 200,000 of which were killed during the Stalin epoch! That is thousand times the number of Witnesses that were executed during the Nazi regim! Not only totalitarian Communist countries, but also totalitarian Muslim countries have persecuted Christians and forbidden their activity. Where the activity of the Witnesses is forbidden or restricted by totalitarian governments, the activity of other Christian groups are usually also forbidden or restricted, although we don't read much about this in the Watchtower publications. In fact, more Christians have died for their faith in the 20th century than in the previous 19 centuries combined! This fact is documented in the book, In the Lion's Den (Nashville, Tennessee: Broadman & Holman Publishers, 1997), written by Nina Shea, director of the Puebla Program division of Freedom House. The persecution of Jehovah's Witnesses in the 20th century, therefore, is far from unique or exceptional. Today, cases of persecution of Jehovah's Witnesses are rare and exceptional, as was actually admitted in The Watchtower of December 1, 1998, page 8 feature often pointed to in the Watchtower publications is that Jehovah’s Witnesses have been persecuted and sometimes even been killed in some countries. This is true, of course. Perhaps the most extensive persecution of the Witnesses in the 20th century was that of the Nazi regime in Germany a generation ago, when 2,000 Witnesses were sent to concentration camps, 203 of which were executed and over 600 others died in prison due to diseases, undernourishment, and other causes. (The 1974 Yearbook of Jehovah’s Witnesses, page 212.)
But Jehovah’s Witnesses are not the only group that has been persecuted in this century. Totalitarian countries have often persecuted various groups of Christians. In the former Sovjet Union most and sometimes all Christian groups were forbidden and persecuted, and periodically thousands of Christians were killed in campaigns aimed at rooting out religion. On January 27, 1996, Vladimir Naumov, chief of the Russian commission for the restoration of victims of political oppression, revealed that half a million priests had been persecuted by the Sovjet State, over 200,000 of which were killed during the Stalin epoch! That is thousand times the number of Witnesses that were executed during the Nazi regim!
Not only totalitarian Communist countries, but also totalitarian Muslim countries have persecuted Christians and forbidden their activity. Where the activity of the Witnesses is forbidden or restricted by totalitarian governments, the activity of other Christian groups are usually also forbidden or restricted, although we don’t read much about this in the Watchtower publications. In fact, more Christians have died for their faith in the 20th century than in the previous 19 centuries combined! This fact is documented in the book, In the Lion’s Den (Nashville, Tennessee: Broadman & Holman Publishers, 1997), written by Nina Shea, director of the Puebla Program division of Freedom House. The persecution of Jehovah’s
Witnesses in the 20th century, therefore, is far from unique or exceptional. Today, cases of persecution of Jehovah’s Witnesses are rare and exceptional, as was actually admitted in The Watchtower of December 1, 1998, page 8

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-2736 Anonymous Tue, 16 Jan 2007 08:48:02 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-2736 No wonder the bus is stopping to let you off. No wonder the bus is stopping to let you off.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-2735 Anonymous Tue, 16 Jan 2007 08:44:46 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-2735 Although others have commented to your quotes, I note with reference that J'Ws are also losing members and that is fair comment. The fact still remains however that the preaching and teaching work by J'Ws has not been "overthrown" and continues throughout the globe. Can other religions make the same claim? And what harlot is this other person talking about? The one that he himself is riding on!! Although others have commented to your quotes, I note with reference that J’Ws are also losing members and that is fair comment. The fact still remains however that the preaching and teaching work by J’Ws has not been “overthrown” and continues throughout the globe. Can other religions make the same claim? And what harlot is this other person talking about? The one that he himself is riding on!!

]]> By: D111115 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-2734 D111115 Wed, 13 Dec 2006 12:52:46 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-2734 12 MILLION of those bloodsucking cult members by 2020????? That is worse than Katrina, the Asian tsunami, and 9/11/2001 all put together! Help! 12 MILLION of those bloodsucking cult members by 2020????? That is worse than Katrina, the Asian tsunami, and 9/11/2001 all put together! Help!

]]> By: fri http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/comment-page-1/#comment-2733 fri Sat, 08 Jul 2006 18:13:18 +0000 http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/psychological-social-issues/returning-to-eden-futuristic-symbolism-and-its-effects-on-jehovahs-witnesses/#comment-2733 And how can we obtain this vision of sense???Only by becoming a JW???? And how can we obtain this vision of sense???Only by becoming a JW????

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