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Book Review: Crisis of Conscience -by Raymond Franz

September 22nd, 2001 Leave a comment Go to comments

(Investigator No. 4 1989 January)

Crisis of Conscience
by Raymond Franz former member of the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses
(Commentary Press, 1983, 375 pages)

This book was banned, even before it was written.

The author, Raymond Franz, had been under ban by the Watchtower Society since 1981, when he was excommunicated for eating a meal with a previously banned individual, his landlord. Three million Jehovah’s Witnesses are now forbidden to speak to Franz, read his book, or even say “Hello” if they pass him on the street.

And the Watchtower does well to shield its followers from this man — if they are to remain followers. Nephew of the organization’s 94-year-old president Fred Franz, Raymond spent nine years as a member of its top-secret Governing Body. The inside information Franz now reveals in his book is sufficient to shake any Jehovah’s Witness’s faith — not in God, but in the organization claiming to be God’s mouthpiece.

Can little Johnnie receive an organ transplant, or must his parents refuse? Can Mrs Smith do as her husband wishes in bed, or must she say “NO” to him? Can Jack accept hospital work as an alternative to military service, or must he refuse and go to jail?

If little Johnnie’s parents, Mrs. Smith, and Jack are Jehovah’s Witnesses, their answers come from Watchtower headquarters in Brooklyn, New York. And the final word rests with the Governing Body. As a member of that elite group, Ray Franz had to share in making these decisions for Witnesses worldwide. As the Body’s votes swung this way and that — and millions of Witnesses’ family life or very lives swayed in the ballance — Franz became more and more conscience stricken at what he saw happening.

One chapter details how the Governing Body decided that certain conduct between husband and wife in bed would be grounds for divorce and disfellowshipping (formal excommunication and shunning). After the edict was issued (The Watchtower 12/1/72, pages 734-736) numerous marriages broke up as a result. Then, seven years later, the Governing Body changed its mind and reversed the policy.

In the same way, the Governing Body was legislating other personal matters for Jehovah’s Witnesses: medical treatment, family relationships, etc. Rank-and-file J.W.s accepted the Governing Body’s decisions as “God’s law”, but Ray Franz knew that each decision was a mere product of the human whims, opinions and prejudices of his peers as they tossed ideas around and put them to a vote. Franz called to mind Jesus’ words to the Pharisees: “Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition…their teachings are but rules made by man.” (Matthew 15: 6,9 New International Version)

Like Quakers, Mennonites, Seventh Day Adventists and others, Jehovah’s Witnesses have long refused to bear arms as soldiers. But, unlike these others, the Witnesses have also refused civilian “alternative service” work in hospitals. (Witnesses tell the judge that their decisions are the result of personal conscience, but, in reality any Witness not following the organization’s instructions would be “disassociated” — cut off from friends and family the same as if disfellowshipped.) This practice came into question in a series of Governing Body meetings in 1978.

A motion was made at each one of those meetings to allow J.W.s to accept civilian hospital work. In each meeting a majority of the Governing Body (Franz names them) voted in favor of the change. But the resolution never passed because a two-thirds majority was required. So, young men among Jehovah’s Witnesses continued to refuse civilian work in hospitals — and thus faced jail sentences — even though a majority of the Governing Body felt there was no objection to such work.

Another “conscience” issue for Witnesses involved political party membership cards. When the ruling element in the African country of Malawi demanded that citizens purchase “party cards”, the Watchtower Society took a stand against it. In adhering to this position Malawian Witnesses faced imprisonment, beatings and severe mistreatment at the hands of government loyalists.

Meanwhile, in Mexico Witnesses were in the habit of bribing officials to obtain cards identifying them as members of the reserves who had fulfilled a year of military service. Not having the cartilla would result in some inconvenience, but not the sort of suffering Witnesses faced in Malawi

Franz relates in detail how Watchtower headquarters gave its approval to both policies leaving African J.W.s to face brutal persecution while permitting Mexican Witnesses to buy cards ‘under the table’. This caused much suffering in Africa. And it helped cause the “crisis of conscience” Raymond Franz experienced as a member of the Governing Body whose votes enforced these contradictory rulings.

The final portion of Crisis of Conscience is devoted to the events surrounding Ray’s removal from the Body and subsequent expulsion from the organization of Jehovah’s Witnesses. If it were not for the modern setting and doctrinal issues peculiar to J.W.s the story would sound much like any ‘heresy’ trial from the medieval Inquisition. Or, again, the evidence based on rumor and hearsay could have been taken from the Salem witch trials of colonial Massachusetts.

True, the Inquisition’s victims were burned at the stake, and the “witches” of Salem were hanged, while Raymond Franz was merely deprived of his livelihood, publicly disgraced, and cut off from family and lifelong friends. Still, one is left with the feeling that the only reason why Franz is an author today, instead of a corpse is that the Watchtower Society can not administer capital punishment. From the standpoint of Jehovah’s Witnesses, though, Franz is a dead man

Crisis of Conscience will be of particular interest to J.W.s—the few who dare read it. But it gives all of us food for thought about our personal relationship with God and our attitude toward men who claim religious authority.

Categories: Books & Book Reviews
  1. martin chijara
    May 2nd, 2013 at 08:32 | #1

    I grew up and was baptised a jw the doctrines as presented by the JW have always raised questions in me. when i went through the volumes of books titled insight o the scriptures i realised that the doctrines were not based on the bible for example the jw believe Jesus is michael the archangel when the bible clears says in HEB 1 that God never said to an angel thou art my son today i have begotten thee. Another case in point is the holy communion which Jesus commanded his followers to partake of with the caveat that whoever does not partake has no part in Christ. Contrary to Jesus’instruction they say 144 000 people are the anointed remnant and should partake. this coupled with the doctrines such as the invisible return of Christ are devilish doctrines coupled with false prophecies on dates of Christ’s return are designed to lead many astray thank God for the Holy Spirit who contrary to JW teaching is a Person and is God.

  2. BM
    January 29th, 2013 at 01:57 | #2

    who does not kill in the name of God? There is only one answer to that.

    I’m sorry but you should research that phrase because there are more than just JW’S. It breaks my heart when I hear those words because I know how truly blind that person is who is replying that phrase. Those words that phrase has been around for years and years! They are imbedded in your head and stuck like glue for you to hash over and over again in your mind anytime any where even when doubt creeps in. Please search for the answers because you will find it just as I did.
    AMEN

  3. BM
    January 29th, 2013 at 01:26 | #3

    What I’d like to know is why JW’S are the only ones on the planet that have their very own bible completely different (worded), than any other bible? How is it in the bible (the book of John 1), it states; “In the beginning was the WORD and the WORD was with GOD and the WORD WAS GOD.” In the JW’S little green bible it states; “In the beginning was the WORD and the WORD was with GOD and the WORD was A GOD.” WHAT KIND OF SENSE DOES THAT MAKE, (I repeat what kind of sense does that make)? They teach that satan himself is a god! No where in any bible that I’m aware of does it teach that Jesus is “A GOD!”

  4. james getz
    January 18th, 2013 at 09:41 | #4

    @Confused
    I grew up as a witness,I Love Jehovah and not confuesd however, like Peter replied to Jesus Where else will we go to Lord. Read Bible, pray for guidance and I have no doubt the answer will be presented. There is much dissatifaction in the organization but Jehovah is revealing all in his time.

  5. Arthur Lawrence
    December 28th, 2011 at 05:20 | #5

    It seems now that the internet is full of gossip on top of gossip and one sided
    opinions about all the WRONGS of the WT Society. Exzactly what Satan loves-he
    can’t get at Jesus so he goes after the followers.

    Don’t help him!

  6. henryk
    December 25th, 2011 at 09:58 | #6

    i hate Jehowa witnesses

  7. joe
    July 12th, 2011 at 14:31 | #7

    One of the best things the bible offers us humans is that it was written by actual humans not angels or GOD. So when you cite Ecc. as a reference you forgot to mention that it was King Solomon’s human point of view that was inaccurate.

    For example, we also have the story of Job who was a faithful servant of Jehova who thought that God had forsaken him without any reasonable cause. He was confused as to why god abandoned him and even questioned his authority. Later Job recognized that his point of view was inaccurate ( Job 42:1-3) ” Who is this that is obscuring counsel without knowledge? therefore I talked, but I was not understanding things too wonderful for me, Which I do not know”.

    You See king Salomon was not even in agreement with everything being vanity. As Ecclesiastes 1:2 says “The greatest vanity!” the CONGREGATOR HAS SAID, “the greatest vanity! Everything is vanity!” What profit does a man have in all his hard work at which he works hard under the sun?”

    He personally knew that being faithful to Jehova untill his death was the only thing that would save the soul Not riches or materialistic possessions.

    Ecc. 12:13-14 ” the conclusion of the matter, everything having heard is: Fear the True God and keep his commandments. For this is the whole obligation of man. For the true God himself will bring every sort of work into the judgement in relation to every hidden thing, as to whether it is good or bad.

    True Christians, do not let your faith in God be trampled by non believers. All that we have in this world to save or soul is the bible and your faith. When you start believing that everything is vanity the only one that loses out is yourself. Remember that Satan is like a roaring lion that is trying to devour everything and anything in its path.

    Do not believe that you are doing everything in vanity for Jehova himself will reward you if you can just keep his commandments close to your heart and have faith that he will save you from this wicked corrupted world.

    For if you do not have faith now and reject God’s existence while living on earth, likewise God will reject those who did not believe in him when it is time to enter his kingdom. (Matt 7:21-27)

  8. patty
    May 10th, 2011 at 17:59 | #8

    @Confused
    If you google Crisis of Conscience pdf you can find a full copy of the book.

  9. martin
    April 4th, 2011 at 19:51 | #9

    Just think,Issac Newton dialed in on Daniels Prophecy.Didn’t have Faithful Slave to Discern it either.So Watchtower just ROBBED EVERYONE ELSE’S DISCOVERIES,HAD MILLERS,JONAS WINDELL,WILLIAM STORRS,and Nelson BARBOURS research to go by.Doesn;t seem like GOD DIRECTED THEM TO ANYTHING.THEY ALSO USED ALL THE WRONG DATES.LOOKS as if TACKING BACK THEN DIDN’T WORK EITHER.NEITHER DID NEW LIGHT POLICY.THEY EVEN LIE ABOUT the DRUNK RUTHERFORD,and BERTA PEALE,16 yr old MISTRESS,I MEAN DIETICIAN,NEW LIGHT.I THINK ADAM GOT NEW LIGHT FROM SATAN IN GARDEN.NEED TO NAME WATCHTOWER,PING PONG,they are ALL OVER THE TABLE.WHEN YOU PUT DOG POOP IN A CLEAN DECORATED BOX,OPEN it ,IT IS STILL DOG POOP.WAKE UP PEOPLETHEY DON’t MAKE PREDICTIONS ,I MEAN PROPHESY,ANY MORE.THREE STRIKES AND YOU ARE OUT.

  10. Confused
    March 8th, 2011 at 15:32 | #10

    Does anyone know where I can get a copy of this book??? Everywhere is “Out Of Stock”. I grew up a JW, never baptised though. Attended meetings off and on through my teenage years and never since 2002. Trying to find my way now, exploring other Christian “denominations” but have the hardest time “letting go”. This book has been recommened by a few people. Even if I could just borrow it… I am in Canada

  11. Vic
    February 14th, 2011 at 21:22 | #11

    Franz still held to the major doctrines such as the trinity etc.

    I was in a religious organisation ( not JW ) and I was high up in this organisation & one of the most difficult things I had to deal with was personalities.

    I could have spit the dummy the dummy but I waited, the point I am making is that maybe Franz could have waited to a more opportune time to resolve matters.

    It reminds me of when the Apostle Paul had a dispute with Peter over Circumcision.

    I know Franz is talking about conscience but I am just wondering if the whole matter was not a dispute over personalities.

  12. darryl
    February 13th, 2011 at 19:32 | #12

    I grew up in that nutty religion, the probable with it and every other fundamentalist religion is that people or should i say nutty people are in charge of running it. Raymond Franz chose to leave because like the many of us that do are normal sane people who don’t want live dysfunctionally anymore. For those that still do it and are questioning it, check out Prof Richard Dawkins doco entitled “The Root Of All Evil” about fundamentalist religions like that one. Cheers Darryl

  13. Ole Helle-Broe
    June 8th, 2010 at 18:38 | #13

    Raymond Franz.
    Raymond and Cynthia will always been in our prayers. He was the most humble man I ever had contact with.
    I wrote this him to him August 27, 2009:
    Dear Raymond,
    Something terrible has happen to our family, our daughter Mette’s 21 year old daughter Jessica was killed in
    a car accident yesterday, Wednesday. Mette asked me today if you could help us with some guidance for
    the funeral service, just a little talk. You are the only one who can help us now in this sad situation. We just
    sit and cry. Please help us.
    Kind regards
    Ole Helle-Broe,
    Australia.
    The same day, August 27, he send us this comforting letter:
    Dear Ole and family,
    We were very sorry to hear of the death of your granddaughter, Jessica. I am sure it will take some time for
    you to adjust to the loss, and even more so on the part of her mother. God’s Word recognizes the uncertainty
    of life and the unpredictable circumstances that can occur, as Ecclesiastes 9:11 says “time and chance
    (unforeseen occurrence) happen to all.” God’s Son was himself moved to tears on seeing the grieving of
    Lazarus’ sisters at the time of Lazarus’ death. (John 11:33-35)
    Even as the greatest appreciation of water comes with being very thirsty, and of food when being very
    hungry, or of sleep when being extremely tired, so too one can appreciate the crucial value and beauty of the
    resurrection hope, and the strength it gives, most particularly when experiencing the loss of a loved one, or
    when facing death oneself. The Scriptural knowledge shared by you and your family that death is
    comparable to sleep and that those sleeping in death can be awakened from that sleep by Christ’s call
    awakening them to return to life (John 5:25, 28, 29) aids tremendously to give relief to sorrow, so that as
    Christians we “may not grieve as do others who have no hope.” (1 Thessalonians 4:13, 14) You have the
    hope of seeing Jessica again and should feel even more motivated to faithfulness in your service to God and
    his loving Son who will make that possible.
    I completed 88 years of life in May and Cynthia reaches 76 in August, so we both recognize that the time
    remaining for us is not great. One thinks of the words of the psalmist, “Our years come to an end like a sigh.
    ” (Psalm 90:9, 10) While “our outer nature is wasting away, our inner nature is being renewed day by day,”
    as we look “not at what can be seen but at what cannot be seen,” not at the temporary, but at the eternal,
    having entrusted ourselves to “a faithful Creator.” (2 Corinthians 4:16-18; 1 Peter 4:19)
    As regards a “funeral service” this is entirely a matter for personal choice. For myself, following my death I
    would personally prefer not to have some formal service held in a “funeral parlor” but would prefer that those
    of my friends who are able and would care to, would come to our home to meet with my wife and join
    together in comforting her, recalling whatever pleasant association they had had with me, and any
    experiences of worth and value that resulted from this. But as I say, that is only my personal preference and
    is not presented as something for others to be guided by. Mette’s wishes should be given priority and if she
    feels a regular funeral service is best then that is what you should do. In that case, as family head you might
    preside in discussing the wonderful hope God provides in his Word, and perhaps then give other family
    members the opportunity to each make their personal expression. Again these are only thoughts and
    whatever choice your family makes is the one to be governed by.
    We wish you God’s help now in reconstructing your life after this loss and I trust that your giving mutual
    support and comforting one another will give added meaning to the daily life of each of you.
    Our sincere regards and sympathy,
    Ray and Cynthia
    A part of this was used at our grand daughters funeral service. Thanks Raymond, you were always there with an
    answer.
    YOU WILL BE MISSED BY THOUSANDS

  14. aaron brown
    January 7th, 2010 at 12:28 | #14

    morality is doing what is right, regardless of what you are told, RELIGION is doing what you are told regardless of what is right. jw have the picture of promise put before them, they are blinkered, cant look left or right, you worship in fear of condenment at armageddon

  15. January 7th, 2010 at 08:14 | #15

    disfellowshipped :First I’m sorry for the mispelling in previous note. After this I will try to refrain from comment for it is futile to debade these things with opinions… Scripture is required for accuracy.
    Markus, please read Daniel again. Yes the scriptures explain themselves and leave very little room for thinking of it as “tea leaves”. Dan. 8:20, 21 refer to beasts which symbolize nations and it says which nations the beasts symbolize. In this case it is talking about a sequence of kings, it even says, “the ram . . with two horns . . . is the kings of Media and Persia” Also with verse 21, the king of greece. This is very significant in that it is talking about nations that have existed on the earth. It also goes on to tell of future happenings with nations that will follow. Notice, it the progression of nations is not indefinite. It ends at a point. Don’t you wonder when that is? Do you think that any religion in the entire world and it’s history can explain that? There is only one. Jehovah’s Witnesses.

    Sorry this is a well known prophesy, Our church has been teaching about Daniel’s book from 1850’s JW’s seem not to have any understanding of the book REV. though
    that is too bad. It’s really not that hard a book.

  16. January 7th, 2010 at 08:07 | #16

    @disfellowshipped
    Are you SURE there is only one church teaching about Daniel?? Many books can be found starting in the 1700’s about Daniel’s prophesies. Many of these relate the prophesy in exactly the same way. It is after all an easy one to read and understand….. Our church has been teaching about Daniel’s book from 1850’s The book of Rev. is the same prophesy using beasts referring to a later time line (both end with the coming of Christ) INcludes the church of Rome, and USA in same prophesy. REV. Chap 8-9

  17. December 29th, 2009 at 03:44 | #17

    @otto
    “”you will never have a clue of what i’m i talking about”"you are a fool otto just that i am more intelegent than you. and you are a liar than the devil himself and you join hand in hand with the devil accusing innocent people if your word is true as you say why dont you act with humans law to get those poeple punished. and than offcause you have no prove of that, how do you want me to get a clue of your lie otto. i act where there is proof, you fool and i dont want to be blindend by yo lie im illuminated by the trueth which a fool like you will never grip you are such a scum yourelsf otto you are uncertain unburden unbelievable person only a fool like you will a get a clue of your lie. and i will never buy macoroni or tomato cause is related to your name braat.

  18. December 22nd, 2009 at 08:29 | #18

    @markus
    o dia corruption what do you expect if imperfect human is rulling this world it has to be corrupted.but that doesent mean you are enjoying perfect life there in australia im sure you mis africa somehow. but anyway how was the wind that was there in august i had it was terreble they even called it armagedon. how did you endure itt do you mind to tell me a beat of it. and tell me how is the preaching work there it is easy like in africa

  19. Markus
    December 18th, 2009 at 07:15 | #19

    @petra

    I am not as you say amerish, I was afrish but due to the corruption and lack of government protecting basic human rights I am now australianish.

    Cheers,
    Markus

  20. December 16th, 2009 at 01:36 | #20

    @markus
    o you dont understand im sory dear i will not explain myself we african we dont speak and writte amerish we sppeak afrish and writte afrish. by the way we have something like zimlish and namlish and safrish.and if you dont enjoy preaching work in america come and do it in africa you will enjoy it. maybe you will get the luv you are missing in america cause i can see from your words that you people dont love each other there, try it someway else you might be missing something. even jesus said if they mistred you in your city move to another place, is good advisi try it. and hey come with your friend otto marconi. chau sweet luv ya

  21. Markus
    December 15th, 2009 at 08:20 | #21

    @petra
    Don’t understand, is this English? Please explain.
    Cheers,
    Markus

  22. December 15th, 2009 at 06:19 | #22

    @otto marconi
    i will not comment on your dirty ward sweet. love you.

  23. December 14th, 2009 at 09:12 | #23

    @otto marconi. your speach is so shoking you got a narve to call someone scum well done. keep it up with your hatred. bye

  24. November 24th, 2009 at 06:00 | #24

    well,well prof,j a degree that made you to find out that god does not exisit welldone. the bible says the knowledge of the world is beneficial for a little whille just a little, but the knowledge of god benefits in everything and is for ever. sory for my english im not so educated like you but i love being a jw.and im waiting for the memont when the knowledge of god is filling the whole earth

  25. aha_ua
    November 23rd, 2009 at 15:24 | #25

    Hi everyone, you have to watch this film, truth is obvious youtube.com/watch?v=PjrhkKFuOT0&feature=PlayList&p=B65B1AB3F354ABC6&index=0&playnext=1

  26. Prof. z
    November 19th, 2009 at 02:26 | #26

    Prof. z :After years secrectly attending college, getting a degree, and doing massive reseach. I, a fading JW, discovered that YHWH is a lesser god of the Egyptians. This was a shock but I felt I had finally been freed from ignorance. I never fully accepted everything the organization said or did.How can I go from Door to Door and tell people “the truth” when I dont even know it myself! Like Dave, I retain many basic teachings such as; no war, racism, prejudice, kindness to my fellow human being.I do know that one organization cannot fulfill God’s will. The Infinite mind is just too big for 8 men in the entire world to have that cell phone number!

  27. Prof. z
    November 19th, 2009 at 02:25 | #27

    After years secrectly attending college, getting a degree, and doing massive reseach. I, a fading JW, discovered that YHWH is a lesser god of the Egyptians. This was a shock but I felt I had finally been freed from ignorance. I never fully accepted everything the organization said or did.
    How can I go form Door to Door and tell people “the truth” when I dont even know it myself! Like Dave, I retain many basic teachings such as; no war, racism, prejudice, kindness to my fellow human being.
    I do know that one organization cannot fulfill God’s will. The Infinite mind is just too big for 8 men in the entire world have that cell phone number!

  28. Steady Eyes
    November 13th, 2009 at 07:45 | #28

    k

  29. October 30th, 2009 at 18:47 | #29

    I was also duped by the JW’s for year’s, but never joined into one of many cults like their’s. I do feel for the one’s who are shunned and also disfellowshiped, its a tragedy what occurs to some of them, and some even go back and regress, or into other religious cults. I had to use common sense in the knowledge that our heavenly Father Yahweh is Hebrew and so is His Yahshua, and that the J does not originate in the Hebrew alephbet. Then the word Messiah meaning anointed of Yahweh, does not mean Christ think about it Christmas? And the JW’s profess not to observe holidays?, but it was ok for the NWT’s writers, who will not make their names known, to add the bogus names Jehovah, Jesus & Christ to the NWT.

  30. Paul
    January 12th, 2008 at 15:31 | #30

    Markus,
    I know first hand of instances when “private detectives” were employed to harass, spy and set-up people for a fall.
    One young woman was disfellowshipped for “fornication” after getting involved with a guy which became instantly known during the time she complained of repeatedly seeing someone following her and sitting outside her home in his car. The “boyfriend” was gone in a flash after she “sinned”. Sounded like a setup. The guy sitting outside her home I saw myself.
    Scientology has harassed and spyed on dissenters and their attorneys and has even been implicated by some in felonious criminal retribution against oppossers. Just another bad apple.
    Their is no true religion – but their are true Christians.
    Romans 10:8b – 13 “the word of faith we are proclaiming: That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, “Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame.” For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
    Apostle Paul was informed and inspired. The Holy Spirit is not deceitful. Paul described two requirments for salvation, not five, or even more but two. It is that basic. It is not being a simpleton to understand this as two requirements. It is just two! The Watchtower’s followers are all trying to save themselves with their works against the facts of Ephesians 2:8,9. That WT formed a paradox. They quote these passages yet say “More is needed”. Paradoxes need to be resolved. The WT is wrong. Salvation by grace – undeserved favor – is the reality. “Undeserved kindness” is a misleading phrase, God is kind, but he FAVORS us for everlasting life when we don’t deserve it. They made “grace” a forbidden term. Resolve the paradox and the WT ideas become null and void. Macgregor ministries http://www.mmoutreach.org/ has a nicely written area explaining biblical salvation versus the WT idea. I was in 45years as a JW. They joined the UN, let child molesters run free, lie, false prophecy and blame God by claiming “new light” when the “old light” was in a “letter from Jehovah” too. Oh, they weren’t formed to find the Christianity of the Bible but rather “the Freemasonry of the Bible”. An incompatible thing I note.
    Blessings, Paul

  31. January 9th, 2008 at 05:54 | #31

    Hi Debra. What part of the UK are you from? Why did you leave the JW religion? Are you disfellowshipped as well?

  32. January 8th, 2008 at 16:53 | #32

    Sorry i dont have the information i just wanted to say Hi too im a former witness too
    debra_from_uk@yahoo.com
    (email me if you want to)

  33. January 8th, 2008 at 08:43 | #33

    Does anyone have any information on Hayden Covington? I’ve read minor bits on him but am having difficulties getting any substance. Any direction towards websites, books etc. etc. would be greatly appreciated.

    fyi i’m a disfellowshipped former witness and son of a one-time elder.

  34. In defense of JWs
    January 7th, 2008 at 00:59 | #34

    That is a brilliant comment above.

    There has been a comparison of the “Salem Witch Trials” concerning Mr. Franz’s disfellowshipping from the religion.

    I think instead, it is appropriate to liken the attacks made against the Watchtower Society to a witch hunt. Why do people seem so eager to denigrate Jehovah’s Witensses? Is it because they are among the few who try to live moral, quiet lives? Is it because they try to help people get close to the God of the Bible? Why do we not hear of the other religions being smeared as much? What are they doing or not doing that is so pleasing to everyone that they are measuring up? Or is it easier to follow their guidelines, since they may not require much in the way of making changes in your life? If that is the reason, then we have to wonder if we are living contrary to Bible principles and the religion we are currently in seems to be turning a blind eye to it. If that is the case, are we in the same religion that Jesus was in?

  35. Anonymous
    January 6th, 2008 at 23:16 | #35

    disfellowshipped, Please remove your head form the WT’s ass, than you will be able to see clearly what the truth is!

  36. disfellowshipped
    January 6th, 2008 at 21:50 | #36

    First I’m sorry for the mispelling in previous note. After this I will try to refrain from comment for it is futile to debade these things with opinions… Scripture is required for accuracy.

    Markus, please read Daniel again. Yes the scriptures explain themselves and leave very little room for thinking of it as “tea leaves”. Dan. 8:20, 21 refer to beasts which symbolize nations and it says which nations the beasts symbolize. In this case it is talking about a sequence of kings, it even says, “the ram . . with two horns . . . is the kings of Media and Persia” Also with verse 21, the king of greece. This is very significant in that it is talking about nations that have existed on the earth. It also goes on to tell of future happenings with nations that will follow. Notice, it the progression of nations is not indefinite. It ends at a point. Don’t you wonder when that is? Do you think that any religion in the entire world and it’s history can explain that? There is only one. Jehovah’s Witnesses.

  37. disfellowshipped
    January 6th, 2008 at 21:06 | #37

    There is and can be only one truth. Think about that. Since that is true and so many contradicting beliefs and practices prove it, we must ask ourselves, who has it, thruth I mean? Who seems to be and are trying with every fiber of their being to live as closely as Jesus did when he walked the earth. Who? Think, who does not kill in the name of God? There is only one answer to that. Jehovah’s Witnesses. I am a disfellowshipped Jehovah’s Witness. First I will say I do not think there is enough that I can say to defend the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses. We are all imperfect in a very imperfect world. Can we expect perfection from anyone? I don’t think so. As for accusations of an inquisition against Raymond Franz, I think there are many things that we do not know concerning the happenings and findings. As for the rest of us, are we looking for reasons to believe that the JW’s are wrong? Should we ask oursleves why? Is it possible that we have overlooked the fact that there is and can be only one truth. Who has it? I looked at many beliefs, customs, etc. before I became a Jehovah’s Witness. I decided they had the truth, not because I wanted to quit smoking and living a care free life, but because I was asking what is this life in general all about? When you find the truth, we know it, whetheror not we like what it requires us to do or stop doing. I think when we humans don’t like the idea that a belief may require us to stop going with the norm, we may find ways to deny that it is the truth. It is ok to be a follower, but not to follow the masses just because we are afraid to be different or that we may be looked down upon by some one we think is cool. By the way isn’t “cool” a facade anyway? Then there are some of us imperfect humans who will say, “you mean I have to quit smoking, etc?”. I am still smoking, so I am still disfellowshipped. I am going back to meetings and I will quit smoking and be reinstated. I choose the truth and not to follow the crowd. I think you all understand what I am saying.

  38. BENj saw through it all
    January 4th, 2008 at 17:03 | #38

    I love that comment about Markus being angry. In my opinion Markus was overly strong and it’s much better getting your point across with nicely worded reason. However, then going on to admit that you just happen across pro KKK sites in your daily browsing. (Because it certainly does not happen) and then right at the calling him a pig! How old are you??

    Is that the correct response from a JW? who I’m sure will smugly know that ‘we have an answer to every question you throw at us’ come on

    4/10 must do better

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